it's always going to a friend going to another friend, and the friend ends up getting caught. and we also see defenses which is i never actually planned to do it. i was never actually going to go forward with this. it was just idle talk. and i think what they're going to say here, they're going to say he was entrapped. >> that's what i was going to ask you, it seems like the friend was trying to get in touch with him. >> look, if they can get that tape excluded from evidence. there's going to be very little that the authorities have. they need that tape in evidence. and they're going to say, look, i was never going to go forward with this and this guy starts giving me ideas, why don't you do this or do that. >> how common are these incidences in hostile in cases like this? >> they're not. i don't think they're that relevant here you're talking about a misdemeanor case in 1995. you're talking about an allegation with regard to his conduct at school in 2001. remember, there was never an allegation of him doing anything to children. it was always the way that he dealt with author